Wolf is the only ammunition company that provides a 100% performance guarantee. Appreciate your opinions. Since 2005, Wolf Performance Ammunition has been one of the world leaders in high quality affordable ammo. that they can scavenge empties to their benefit, and they cant scavenge the lead (feasibility) with the steel jacket. [2022], LifeStraw vs Sawyer MINI: Best Survival Water Filters for Off Grid, Outdoor Rec and More [2023], 7 Best Emergency Solar Power Kits, Reviewed 2023 [Emergency Solar Power Generators for Going Off Grid and More], Alone Survival Gear [Best Gear And Tactics For Surviving Alone In the Backcountry - 2023], The 10 Best Survival Multi-Tools, Reviewed 2023 (Tactical Tools For Emergency Prep & EDC), Cheap MREs Online - Where To Buy? However, it is recommended that firearms are thoroughly cleaned after using Wolf ammunition due to the increased rate of carbon build-up within the chamber. They were designed to run on brass. Ive gone through 4,000 rounds of Wolf in the past 3 years, all purchased from BulkAmmo. This appears to be more of a problem with cartridges with narrowly tapering walls (e.g. i dont know if thats true but why risk it. Wolf target rimfire ammo is top shelf stuff. or email us at CustomerService@BulkAmmo.com today! If you are interested in import, export, or wholesale purchase of ammunition, gun components and reloading products, theres no better place than AmmoTerra to find a buyer or supplier of military equipment. Like most foreign ammunition, wolf performance is sold at an affordable price. Just crap ammo. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Important: Don't fire brass after firing steel. If you're planning to shoot Tulammo, make sure that your range allows steel ammo. Wolf Polyformance also produces pistol ammo in .380 ACP, 9x18 Makarov, 9x19mm or 9MM Luger, .40 S&W, and .45 Auto/ACP. It too is quality stuff that Ive had very good luck with. Its all brass cased. They also manufacture .357 Magnum in 158 grain SJHP (Semi-Jacketed Hollow Point) and .44 Magnum in 240 grain JHP (Jacketed Hollow Point) for all of the revolver and lever gun fans out there. The Wolf Rimfire ammunition line is also available and comes in two distinct configurations of 22LR or 22 Long Rifle. As you'll see some people love it, some people don't. Cz82mak september 7, 2012 at 09:21. Check out the Guntweaks Tulammo accuracy test. wolf Learn how and when to remove these template messages, Learn how and when to remove this template message, "[Big 3 East] Wolf Ammo Is Bringing Us A Type 91 Upper -", "Thousands of T91 rifles sold in US in one day: report", Shooting Wolf steel-cased Ammo in an AR15, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wolf_Ammunition&oldid=1136386438, Articles needing additional references from May 2008, All articles needing additional references, Articles with a promotional tone from September 2018, Articles with multiple maintenance issues, Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License 3.0, This page was last edited on 30 January 2023, at 02:19. Copyright 2023 Ammunitionstore.com. Website: http://www.tanvirmahi.com. Just some new plants for them, which I didn't think would be open yet given the situation. WOLF Performance Ammunition has several product lines which include: Unlike some suppliers of such bargain-price ammo, WOLF uses newly-manufactured rounds with non-corrosive Berdan and Boxer type primers. I wouldn't recommend getting Tulammo for those. Tulammo itself is made in by the Tula Cartridge Works in Tula, Russia, about 120 miles outside of Moscow. All of Tulammo's bullets are roughly the same weight, meaning that they group together well. So far, its been over 3,000 rounds downrange in my Ruger P95 and High Point 995. It is annealed or heated and cooled slowly to soften it. Wolf ammo is manufactured by wolf ammunition. The Wolf Gold 223 55 grain FMJ ammo is made in Taiwan. I certainly got better at shooting. As a result, when Wolf cartridges are fired, some of the combustion by-products are deposited between the case and the chamber, causing a build up of carbon that is well in excess of normal. While American owned, And unless you have one of those auto-progressive reloading presses standing by at home shooting brass all the time is going to cost you quite a bit. Some weapons hate steel or aluminum cased ammo. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. The friction increases the heat, which might wear your barrel down faster. Wolf ammunition is made under a trademark owned by SSI, Sporting Supplies International. The popular Wolf Polyformance polymer-coated steel cased ammo is built to ensure reliable function in semi-auto platforms. i use wolf, silver bear and brown bear ammo in my sks and makarov. The Tulammo 9mm is literally made for Glock 17. Currently, WebWOLF Performance Ammunition is a registered trademark owned by SSI Manufacturing Technologies, a corporation in the United States. Wolf products bring high quality components, accuracy, terminal performance on par with more expensive ammo, and a massive selection of calibers and configurations to the table. No, Wolf is not better than Tulammo because they are the same thing. The impressive muzzle velocity and hard-hitting muzzle energy of each of these rounds, coupled with the superb accuracy of each round makes Wolf Gold stand out in the ammo business. Any thoughts on this? 3 misfires out of 3000 rounds. Therefore I tend to stay with brass. According to weapon-blog.com's test conducted on .40 S&W Tulammo Rounds, Tulammo's weight variances are solid. The other offering is the .22LR Match Extra with the same 40 grain round nose solid lead bullets. This Olympic grade Wolf Rimfire ammo is great for competition and one of the most accurate .22 rimfire cartridges on the market. Also some weapons need to be broken in first before they can run everything reliably. Late on August 20, 2021, the Biden State Department added new sanctions to the CBW Act of 1991, which will impact available ammo to firearm owners. As noted, it was previously produced at factories in the former Soviet Union, and even today the company is often described as being a Russian company. By 2023, the full effects of the Russian ammo ban will finally have been felt by the masses, and the old supply of cheap, reliable steel-cased ammo will be sorely missed. WebWell from the opposing side Ive never had problems with Tula or wolf 223/5.56. With the popularity of the Wolf Ammunition brand, target shooters are thus able to take advantage of some of the incredibly accurate SK 22LR ammo at very affordable prices. I stick to quality manufacturers like Federal, Speer/CCI, and Winchester. Couldnt knock the case out at the range, so it ended my shooting for the day. The problem is that its hygroscopic and attracts water from the air to the bore. Banning Russian Ammo So that dirt is graphite, a lubricant used on locks. Call (800) 720-6035 Privacy Policy. My standard for the AK is can I hit a man-sized target center mass at 100 yards with regularity, and it will do that all day with the cheap stuff. Who makes wolf ammo 7.62 x39. If your AR wont run Wolf .223 reliably you have a junky rifle. Breaking: Biden Administration Bans Importation of Russian Guns and Ammo. With a pKa of about 7 its less acidic than lemon juice. The ammunition is mostly manufactured by Tulskiy Patronniy Zavod (Tula Cartridge Plant) in Tula, Tula District, Russia. The 40 S&W ammunition is loaded with 180 grain FMJ to a velocity of 990 fps. I've got zero complaints with Tulammo and will gladly be getting more. I had ordered some wolf ammo that shot fine earlier through a springfield 1911 which encouraged me to make another order thinking i had found good cheap range ammo. I have never seen a company who bills for the product the day after it was ordered. There are plenty of guns that can shoot steel ammo without a problem. All four of my ARs eat it up no problem. I now have roughly 990 rounds of worthless .223 which will not feed and only malfunctions in my guns. Honestly, the only problems Ive ever had with Russian ammo was a couple of boxes of Tula 919 that had a few duds due to hard primers. KH. Last week, the White House announced that it would stop approving new permits to import Russian-made firearms as well as ammunition. my mosin nagant gets surplus corrosive ammo thats even cheaper and fouler to clean. Wolf 22LR rimfire ammo is produced by SK Hunting and Sporting Ammunition in the German Districts of Salzlandkreis and Saxony-Anhalt. I shoot practice ammo, and then routinely check the accuracy and function with high quality self defense loads. End your shooting sessions by firing a couple rounds of non corrosive ammo to blast out the KCl until you can give it a proper cleaning. We have to make one thing crystal clear about this 9mm ammunition: They also havefactories making ammunition in. Unless my gun is jamming up, I don't worry about it being a little dirty inside. From 2005 until 2009, this was the way wolf ammo was manufactured. Wolf Performance Ammunition that features a steel case comes marketed as either Wolf Polyformance or Military Classic brands. Our team has fired roughly 5000 rounds apiece and I am not aware of a single failure that could be blamed on faulty ammo.. Glad to see that the kind folks here appreciate the quality of your work enough to reference it. In my M1A in 308 I found the loads to be very inconsistent with evidence of primers backing out in numerous, but not in all cases, perhaps 20% of the time. Not happy about this . I have had poor experience using Herters, which I believe is manufactured by Wolf. Ill burn the barrel out before I have to replace the extractor. That relationship end several years ago. It has run fine in both of my M88 9mms and both of my 1911 .45s!!! I ended up emailing Armalite to double check because I saw someone in a forum having problems. Biden Administration Bans Importation of Russian Banning the Import of Russian Bullets: Will Wolf Gold is also offered in eight different pistol calibers as well. Sure its dirty, but after a normal range outing isnt all ammo dirty? Regardless, Mini-14s can shoot either .223 or 5.56, with the only exception being the Mini-14 Target model. WOLF Performance Ammunition has several product lines which include: Whats not to like. Cookie Notice .223 Remington) than those with rather steep case walls such as 7.62x39 mm cartridges or pistol ammunition. I have a Russian made(1924 Izvhesk Ordanance Factory) Mosin Nagant 91/30 and I wont shoot anything but the Wolf Gold Match 7.62z54R through it unless I am shooting my own handloads. The steel case most expand so much it nearly is impossible to make it release. The problem is one of carbon deposition, which creates the same end result (i.e. One thing I have been seeing around here, our ranges will not allow steel cased ammo. They are active within the shooting community, and Tulammo remains one of the cheapest ammo options on the market today. I havent had a chance to get out and shoot it yet but before it came in I ordered a bunch of Wolf zinc plated steel cased ammo. Wolf Golds rifle caliber options include: .22-250 Remington, .223 Remington in 55 grain and 75 grain, .243 Winchester, 5.56MM or M193 caliber, 6.5 Grendel in 120 and 123 grain, 6.5X55 Swedish, 7.5 X 55 Swiss, .30-06 Springfield, .270 Winchester, 7MM Remington Magnum, .308 Winchester, 30-30 Winchester, 7.62X54R and 150 grain and 180 grain, 303 British in 150 grain and 170 grain, 8X57 or 8MM Mauser, and 300 Winchester Magnum. M855 Green Tip. AR-15 and M4 don't generally work well with steel-cased ammunition. You must have JavaScript enabled in your browser to utilize the functionality of this website. Like most foreign ammunition, I took my gun to him and asked what would cause that. Its all pretty dirty stuff and the tula smells terrible, but it hasnt failed me yet. I think they really dont feel: 1.) So that I will send to you the specification. Wolf offers 7.62x39 in the 123 grain Bimetal FMJ or Bimetal Hollow Point (HP) with the steel cased cartridge that is primed with a non-corrosive Berdan Primer. Not all tulammo comes from russia. So the ammo is made in Russia, but "Tulammo" as a business is owned and operated from U.S.. This incident happened in the early 2000s, but if memory serves, the box was labeled .223 not 5.56 NATO. Jams often (after 2-3 rounds as you say). Originally, most Wolf ammo was made by the TULA Arms Plant in Tula, Russia. No. (Unless you spend more time cleaning/polishing your gun than actually using it). Let's start with the BIG elephant in the room. [2], Since 2009 The Tula Cartridge Plant and Ulyanovsk Machinery Plant (owned by Tula Cartridge Works since 2005) no longer manufacture cartridges for Wolf due to legal disputes.[3]. Side note: The factory was founded by a bad-ass Russian Czar Peter the Great. WebBarnaul Cartridge Plant JSC (Russian: ) is a manufacturer of industrial goods and ammunition in Barnaul, Altai Krai, Russia. I will not own a picky gun if it wont eat what I feed it I wont own it. Tula manufactures 40 types of small arms ammunition. So it runs a little dirty but is dirt cheap. Using steel ammunition (as opposed to brass) "may" wear your gun out "slightly" faster. Can Tulammo really ruin your gun as some people say? While Wolfs steel cases are polymer coated, it still seems to generate too much friction. WebRussian line includes pistol, rifle and Wolf shogtun ammo in 9mm, 40 S&W, 45 ACP, 7.62x39mm, 5.45x39mm, 7.62x54R mm, 380 Auto, 9x18mm Makarov, and 12-ga buck shot as well as premier Wolf ammo 22 LR Match Target loads. Cz82mak september 7, 2012 at 09:21. Great article with links. Wolf Ammunition | Military Wiki | Fandom Whether you're a fan or not, Ruger engineers their guns to withstand +P and +P+ ammo. Gun owners have become reliant on the ability of companies such as Wolf, Tula and Barnaul to provide reasonably-priced ammunition to the marketplace. Took it out a few months later and shot the 200 rounds of the Wolf ammo I had left with out issue. WebBarnaul Cartridge Plant JSC (Russian: ) is a manufacturer of industrial goods and ammunition in Barnaul, Altai Krai, Russia. Thanks, I ran it through my ar15 it was def a no go made me single shot would not go semi until I put milteck ammo ya so I wont be usin that for my ar15 I have 9 mm steel case on the way hoping the best. As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases. Could be the magazine.Ill have to look into that further. I prefer my custom AR-15 chambered in .223 Wylde to shoot .223/5.56 these days, but I still have the Mini-14. Breaking? Biden bans import of Russian ammo/firearms This also does not seem to pose much of a problem for Soviet or East Bloc designed weapons that tend to have looser chamber clearances than Western designed weapons. Make sure that your range allows steel-cased ammo. Definitely dirty but haventnhad any issues and grouping is tight. I think my 9mm rounds are supposed to have a 1/32 jacket of steel. It's widely used by people. Install almost any gun type and model in a variety of ways for quick access or storage. WebList of 8 Ammunition made in Russia displayed online for wholesale directly from manufacturers, Russian made Ammunition exported and imported. Showing low tolerance and excellent quality. Steel cased ammo does not expand like brass does. Prvi Partizan in Serbia. WOLF as a I have never used Wolf in any of my guns since. I can say that because I use Wolf in most every modern firearm out there and its never given me any problems. While Wolf Performance Ammunition is best known for And the manufacturers dont give it to us: we buy it off the shelf. Originally, most Wolf ammo was made by the TULA Arms Plant in Tula, Russia. Tulammo is accurate and reliable, especially for the price that you pay. Ive used Wolf ammunition extensively, and can report mixed experiences. Just finished rebuilding a Springfield GI45 Lightweight Champion 1911 and ran 300 rds of steel case through it with no feed or extract problems!! I know a number of high-volume shooters who use .223 Wolf without any issues, including in training courses from respected instructors. the only reason i dont use wolf in my sigma 9 is ive heard that it wears the extractors more than brass. Different from other lines, premium Wolf Gold cartridges have a brass casing and use boxer primers for easier reloading. Go ahead and use Tulammo. There are plenty of places to shoot. Originally, most wolf ammo was made by the tula arms plant in tula, russia. Founded in anaheim, calif., in Wolf is my #1 ammo supplier both for cost and giggle factor, they have everything from .22 lr to 12 ga buckshot, I've supported the company, hell I even got the t-shirt made. Contrary to rumors and misunderstandings, Wolf Ammo is not a Russian company and has not been made at the Tula Cartridge Plant (in Tula, Russia) since 2009. Pretty good one would have to say. You only need to worry about milsurp ammo when it comes to corrosiveness.. Tulammo makes steel ammunition. Thanks for watching. I was a little hesitant but with current prices I am going to see what if any issues I have shooting. The ammunition is mostly CMMG has warnings not to shoot steel cased ammo out of their uppers, and I honor that. Who makes wolf match 22lr? If you fire brass ammo after steel cased you run the risk of the brass ammo fusing to the debris and ripping as the extractor attempts to pull it out of the weapon. We have Good price, figgered maybe the russkis ran outta steel to make ammo cases from? It wasnt that the gun shop/indoor range was trying to force customers to buy more expensive ammunition or that it was even trying to ban cartridges from Russia U.S. State Dept. Bans Russian Ammo Imports - Pew I started shooting .223 Wolf in my AR-15, and its been absolutely reliable. It is cheaper but let's stop supporting a Russian company. Minor quibble. In the end, it depends on your gun. Mahi International Some .22-caliber rimfire ammunition is made by SK Jagd und Sportmunitions GmbH (SK Hunting- and Sporting-Ammunition) of Schnebeck, Salzlandkreis, Saxony-Anhalt, Germany. For sure. If you've got an AK - you'll love Tulammo. The high-quality components of Wolf Gold ammunition make it both accurate and precise for tactical and hunting applications. Clean the weapon between firing different ammunition. Amongst all of us, this happened pretty frequently. But people who do haven't reported any issues with Tulammo's Berdan primers. Founded in anaheim, calif., in 1996, they began by importing new production sporting ammunition in popular combloc military calibers from russia. Wolf is a distributor. However, Wolf Performance Ammunition (WPA) is actually just a trademark of Sporting Thousands of rounds, for years, everything is fine with no issues. This is the last time I spent a cent on anything steel. Wolf ammo is an american based brand name of ammunition, firearms, optics, and accessories. Theres a common misconception that KCl is this immensely corrosive compound. Shopping Cart Software by BigCommerce. HIGH VISIBILITY splatter target makes it EASY to see your shots at a distance. Since its founding, it has been the exclusive importer of the wolf brand and for years the ammo was. Cheapest possible AK with cheap ammo, and it works. Online retailer Guns.com said it noticed a significant increase in sales on 7.6239 ammo to include brands like Barnaul, Red Army Standard, and Wolf. Russian guns were designed to run steel. The steel used in the cases is soft steel. I have never had a problem with any of my guns since. I know I was guilty of that, but this was my first non rimfire semi auto rifle too. Then I gave it a thorough cleaning and its been 100% since then. It would not load, and once I had a failure as the bolt got locked after the round fired and wouldn't extract. Whether or not Tulammo will work for you depends on your gun. Shortest is an 11.5 pistol and longest is a 20, all shoot steel with no problems. Any truth to that? Just because it doesn't work for someone doesnt' mean that it won't work for you. Because for self protection you want a hollow point round that will expand when it his flesh. WebThe cartridge remained the Soviet standard until the 1970s, and is still one of the most common intermediate rifle cartridges used around the world. Corrosive primers leave a residue of potassium chloride salt, which upon firing follow the other gases. CLT has a chunk of 9mm priced ok for now so we will have some reviews soon. That's 7 to 10 failures in each 20-round box of a 1000rd case. Those of you that do are setting yourself up for failure. The majority of their steel-cased, centerfire ammunition is, however, produced in Russia. You shouldn't expect world-class accuracy performance here. Stackable and easy to secure ammo crate with 4 cans. Dear sir/Madam, Oh well. E-mail: [emailprotected] Steel-case ammo is great for another reasoncleanup. That was less positive. (and don't shoot more than 500-600 rounds per session). Search Tips, Posted Ammo It's made to shoot. My buddys M&P sport shoots crappy Wolf, Tula, and Herters ammo all day long. In 2005/2006, there was a shortage of 7.62x39mm ammunition in the United States. List of 8 Ammunition made in Russia, Russian made At the same time, the United States military was trying to outfit and arm a military force that was just getting started in Afghanistan. Today I tried shooting some Tulammo 223 through my AR-15s and neither would shoot beyond one round. Wolf Being I shot 3000 rounds of Wolf and TulAmmo out of my Colt AR15. Please let me know if I'm still allowed to buy it. Wolf ammunition is made under a trademark owned by ssi, sporting supplies international. I made the mistake of putting some 7.6239 wolf in a cabinet in my humid basement just in the cardboard box it comes in (not thinking about it) . I understood they said it would be 5 weeks, but now it has been 6 weeks. The short answer is yes, Wolf Ammunition is manufactured in accordance with SAAMI standards. I have an M16 that has fired at least 20k rounds through it. As info based on my experience. Wolf ammo is incredibly popular since it is one of the most affordable types of ammunition available while WOLF Performance Ammunition has several product lines which include: Unlike some suppliers of such bargain-price ammo, WOLF uses newly manufactured rounds with non-corrosive Berdan- and Boxer-type primers. This blocks debris from blowing back into the weapon. Yeah, made the mistake of firing corrosive ammo through my old SKS, let it sityears later it was a rust bucket. Advanced Search | Posted: 8/20/2021 6:30:30 PM EDT [#25] From the other thread Quoted: This type of ammunition is labeled "bimetal". Side Note: Tulammo,Wolf Ammo, and Herter's international are all the same thing in different packaging. Wolf Ammuniton Spotlight - Ammunitionstore.com WebRussian steel accounts for 30-40% of ALL ammo sold in the United states and is the baseline for keeping American brass low (before ruskie stuff came into the states it wasn't uncommon for ammo to be $2+ a round decades ago). On the other hand, they are far behind, but evidently there is no chronological order in which they deliver. This is the real deal, lowest priced 5.56mm remington ammo on the market made by wolf gold. It will pit the bore if you never clean it, but youd have to let it sit in the bore for a while in a humid environment. When these new supplies hit the market, it is unknown how much the prices will have increased. They are value priced, so you can also stack multiple cases of them in your safe without worry, and they are easily stored away so you can shoot them later on down the road. You cant really ask for much more than that. All prices are in USD. I didn't see it mentioned that those bimetallic bullets are not allowed at many (?most) ranges as they "damage the targets". Wolf is well within accordance with all saami standards. As Wolf catches up with demand, new supplies will become available in the United States. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Tula Arms Plant Just a side note, Wolf no longer contracts through Tula for ammo. It won't ruin the barrel, but it can damage the twist over time. Russian ammo When Im done shooting in the desert, I take a jobsite magnet out and use it to pick up spent casings. WebWolf Ammo is primarily manufactured in Russia by the Barnaul factory. I can confirm this from being hit with thousands of ejected cases and I definately know when steel gives me a love tap. Tulammo Review - Good or Bad? (Will It Ruin Your Different from other lines, premium wolf gold cartridges have a brass casing and use boxer primers for easier reloading. Military Wiki is a FANDOM Lifestyle Community. But you and I both know that that's not proper shooting. This issue has nothing to do with the lacquer coating vaporising or melting, as has mistakenly been suggested. After about 500 rounds and some serious cleaning, it purrs like a kitten. The Truth About Wolf Ammo - The Truth About Guns Corrosive ammo in a FNSCAR will pit the chrome on the inside of the barrel. If you have it and shoot it, do so outdoors. Scan this QR code to download the app now. Throughout its history, it has produced weapons for the Russian state. The FNSCAR is piston operated; typically the bolt and carrier are not exposed to gases. I'm getting something between 30% and 50% fail-to-fire. I'm not a Ruger fanboy and have only ever owned one of their .22 MKII pistols until I got the Mini-14. History [ edit ] The factory draws its origins to an ammunition factory established in Saint Petersburg (designated Arsenal "P") in the 19th century. Both Tulammo and Wolf ammo are made at the Tula Ammo Factory in Russia. The bottom line is thatI've never had problems with dirty ammo. Never had any problems with other ammo, this is crap that will be in the trash soon!!! Never any ignition problems, and it has no problem cycling or ejecting. Its pretty easy to stock up on M193 and M855. Wolf While the ammunition was [i]reliable[/i] in terms of ignition, we started to notice frequent problems with the ammunition in Glock and M&P magazines. Thanks for the confirmation in your own testing, its good to hear the experiences of other shooters that put thousands of rounds through various firearms regularly. I go to the range 1-2 times per month. Wolf has worked fine for me in 918 & 7.6239. What can happen is that carbon will build up in your chamber and cause stuck cases (which I talk about in this video). Wolf Ammuniton Spotlight. Firing a brass case (that does expand fully) after using Wolf ammunition can result in the brass case being "glued" into the chamber by the carbon buildup. With that being said, since its Russian ammo were talking about, they do have quality control problems from time to time. Russian manufacturers primarily produce steel cased ammunition for two reasons: If you want old wolf match extra performance then sk's rifle match is the same thing, literally made on the same machines, same lines, just different packaging. Question here is hollow point safer for this kind of shooting, or is this another attempt to shut another range down with some back door gun control? My only about you is, Im still waiting for that shooting video of you and the other nice folks after yall visited The Compound in TN! Either round is an ideal choice for target practice, plinking with friends and family, or Olympic type target competitions. My own experiences with Wolf are pretty limited, so this was good info for me. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Wolf ammo does exactly that and it may be months before you get the product.
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